how long did the battle of ap bac last

In their home stations, commanders were more apt to allow their troops simply to relax than to work with them, and ignored such fundamentals as rifle marksmanship. Vigorous operations still netted good results for the 7th Division in late 1962, but Vann knew that the trend would not last. He finally managed to convince the corps commander, General Cao, to throw in his reserve force, one of the elite parachute battalions. Kirk Douglas, American actor (Spartacus). Meanwhile, a company of infantry in M-113 armored personnel carriers would sweep the western flank of the area. Take your favorite fandoms with you and never miss a beat. ‘It was a miserable…performance,’ Vann raged to Sheehan. Allowing for the inevitable inflation in claims, the American advisers could still calculate that the 7th Division had killed more than 2,000 enemy soldiers, enough to cut deeply into Communist operations in the northern delta region. Paradoxically, being stuck at a junior rank did not necessarily mean that an officer was a poor one; more often, it meant that he was just the opposite. As a consequence, American advisers found fewer really capable officers in the higher ranks of the Vietnamese Army than they expected. Battle of Ap Bac Ap Bac was a city 40 miles southwest of Saigon. Great-looking map. The Battle of Ap Bac was an early war battle that took place on a forgotten field deep in to the Mekong Delta. In the last quarter of the calendar year, Cao’s troops claimed to have killed slightly more than 4,000 Viet Cong in the 7th Division’s tactical zone at a time when the South Vietnamese Army claimed only around 8,000 VC killed in the entire country. During a routine battalion sweep, Alpha company from the 2nd Brigade crossed an open rice paddy and encountered Viet … Cao, horrified in his own way at the disaster of heavy casualties, delayed bringing in the airborne until late afternoon and then dropped them not to the east, where Vann wanted them to block the enemy’s exfiltration, but to the west. 10 days. Eventually, and only through the best efforts of the American adviser with the armored unit, he managed to get the M-113 company to attack the Viet Cong troops that he determined were well dug-in along the tree line in Bac. There was, however, a second reason for the wise Vietnamese commander to avoid battle, even if casualty rates could be kept down. Recollections of 2LT Howard Kirk/3/47th Recon Platoon. What was Operation Rolling Thunder a response to? Vann firmly believed that the Vietnamese had to fight a very personal war, carefully identifying the enemy they killed. Successful military commanders, men whose units got headlines by defeating the Viet Cong regularly, became threats, the sort of popular figures around whom other officers might rally to depose the government. 55. The home district of the 514th VC Regional Battalion, it was an area where villages were fortified with well-prepared foxholes and bomb shelters. Advertisement. The guerrillas, including Le Quan Cong, prepared trenches and bunkers in front of an open field, where they would be able to easily pick off the enemies. The operation convinced Cao of the wisdom of cooperating with Vann, and of allowing Vann’s operations staff to ‘assist’ his own in planning the 7th Division’s strikes against the VC. Diem apparently never grasped that subtle distinction, and simply measured his commanders on the basis of how few casualties their units suffered. The infantry on board took cover in the paddy dikes. The loss should have caused U.S. policy makers to question the value of their efforts to train and equip the ARVN troops, but they failed to perceive the battle's significance. In the opening years of the Vietnam War, a small group of American military advisors and their South Vietnamese allies were facing down the Viet Cong. The APC was ideal for work in the delta because it had a limited swim capability and could maneuver in the marshy and wet ground throughout the region. It came at a time when both sides were hungry for a decisive victory to galvanize their fortunes. Bui Dinh Dam Huynh Van Cao John Paul Vann. It was also worried about inciting the United States into directly supporting South Vietnam, and had recommended … The Battle of Ap Bac was a major battle fought on January 3, 1963, during the Vietnam War. ... quickly deployed in line to the north of Company a so that the battalion was deployed on an assault line 1,000 meters long and facing the east. Anticipating Lyndon Johnson’s later characterization of them, General Harkins and his staff called the Viet Cong ‘raggedy-ass little bastards,’ a contempt that Vann and his advisory team did not share. Artillery fire, sounding at that moment, gave verisimilitude to the story. The Battle of Ap Bac was a major battle of the Vietnam War which was fought on 2 January 1963. The US and ARVN troops mounting their helicopters. If that were true, then the ARVN 7th Division would fight the critical battles of the war from its headquarters at My Tho, less than 40 miles by road from Saigon. So far, the killing had been done at arm’s length, by air power, by artillery and by heavy weapons fire. From then until the end of the year he did so, brilliantly. As time went on, the enemy began to find ways to cope with the American equipment, and the situation was beginning to stabilize again. Ap Bac was a village in the Mekong Delta, about 40 miles southwest of Saigon. Using a capability that the South Vietnamese forces did not suspect they had, the VC listened to ARVN radio transmissions that tipped off the intended movement against Bac. If the enemy fled in that direction, they would be easy targets. In those provinces, the real government was run by the Viet Cong. The intelligence was correct that the enemy was there, but underestimated both their number and quality. Similarly, Diem appointed the province chiefs from the Vietnamese officer corps, again selecting men on the basis of their loyalty and reliability. The US and South Vietnamese ARVN launched an operation to capture a Viet Cong radio transmitter from the village of Ap Tan Thoi, but they were ambushed and forced to retreat in a major Viet Cong propaganda victory.. Further problems existed in the battle-readiness of the soldiers. Sooner or later, the VC would develop an effective means of evading, avoiding, or even countering helicopters and light armor. Billy Edd Wheeler, singer, songwriter ("Jackson," "Coward of the County"). He took care to separate the chains of command so that the province chiefs in the 7th Division’s zone were answerable to Saigon, but not to the division commander. 12,500 miles long. Battle of An Loc North Vientnamese and Vietcong battle for Loc Ninh, a town 15 miles from An Loc. In fact, the fire that was falling on Bac was doing nothing but inflicting more casualties on South Vietnamese troops, a fact observed by Neil Sheehan, who happened to be there at the time. The Vietnamese Air Force, cooperating with the 7th Division, had easy targets and killed almost a hundred, including a battalion commander. Using good fire discipline, the guerrillas kept both the regulars and the civil guards pinned down until darkness fell, when they gradually slipped away, taking with them their wounded and dead. At that time, North Vietnam was hoping for an election, promised under the Geneva Accords of 1954, that would unite North and South Vietnam. The Battle of Ap Bac. Henry Kendall, particle physicist; shared Nobel Prize in 1990. They make the same…mistakes over and over again in the same way.’. Perhaps the most effective technical wrinkle was the armored personnel carrier, the M-113. He was dealing the Viet Cong a series of surprises through his use of firepower and new equipment. Boardgame Review. Superior armament helped to. However, there were actually over 350 Viet Cong in the area, and communist spies warned them that they were soon to be attacked. (From the game's Consimworld folder) The Battle of Ap Bac was the first large-scale fight waged between the Army of the Republic of Vietnam (ARVN) and the National Liberation Front (NLF). Close relations between correspondents and advisers such as Vann gave the other side of the picture. In December 1962, the 7th ARVN Division was ordered to capture the Viet Cong radio transmitter located 40 miles southeast of Saigon at Tan Thoi, which was surrounded by rice paddies and was linked by an irrigation dike to the nearby hamlet of Ap Bac. Intelligence claimed that the transmitter was guarded by only 120 Viet Cong guerrillas, so US advisor John Paul Vann laid out a foolproof plan of attack: 1,200 South Vietnamese troops would attack the village from three sides, and the Viet Cong fleeing through a left-open gap would be destroyed by artillery and airstrikes while Vann observed the fighting from a spotter plane. John Milton, British writer and poet (Paradise Lost). At 6:35 AM on 2 January 1963, ten American helicopters ferried an ARVN company just north of Tan Thoi, and they met no resistance. The other downside to the ARVN style of war was that it was indiscriminate. John Paul Vann and Ap Bac: That brings us to January 1963 and the battle of Ap Bac. Thus, the advisers had to find diplomatic ways to get timid and often incapable officers to pursue the enemy effectively. Unfortunately, the president’s outlook on the war meant that there was little chance that officers loyal to Diem might also be good combat leaders. Diem feared high casualty rates because he believed that casualties were the factor that had triggered the paratrooper coup attempt. I reckon that the current title is … Vann convinced the new division commander to try to trap main force Viet Cong units that his intelligence showed him to be concentrating in that area, hoping that Dam might be more aggressive than Cao had been. Such stark contrasts between high-level evaluations of the fighting and the view of advisers in the field were not news to the press, for MACV Headquarters seemed to have a policy of putting the best possible face on events. If the dismounted troops were pinned down, then perhaps the armored unit could break the stalemate. The Battle of Ap Bac was a major battle of the Vietnam War which was fought on 2 January 1963. Ap Bac is right ( ap is hamlet ,Bac is the name of the hamlet ) Tan Nguyen.69.237.185.1 03:28, 9 December 2006 (UTC)tannguyen The question isn't just 'which is correct'. Dick Butkus, pro football player; inducted into Pro Football Hall of Fame, 1979. When a few more APCs advanced, guerrillas leapt from their foxholes and hurled hand grenades at them, demoralizing the gunners and forcing them to withdraw to past the wrecked helicopters. Grace Hopper, mathematician and computer pioneer. In the south, the two Civil Guard battalions ran into security forces the VC commander had set out against just such an attack. Thomas P. "Tip" O'Neill, speaker of the House of Representatives. Meanwhile, two Civil Guard battalions approached Ap Bac from the south on foot. Western Dinh Tuong Province was very definitely ‘Injun country,’ as American advisers liked to call Viet Cong strongholds. 1965. By that point, the battle was mostly over. The Viet Cong had finally stood to fight the ARVN, and refused to be driven out of their positions even by attacking armored vehicles. Although the Communists were learning not to flee into the open where fighter-bombers could attack them, they were still being surprised by the extraordinary mobility that helicopters gave the government troops and by the discrete firepower of armed helicopters. Redd Foxx (John Sanford), comedian, actor; best known for his starring role in the TV series Sanford and Son. What Went Wrong: The Battle of Ap Bac – Boardgame Review By Rick Martin. These arguments consumed even more precious daylight because the senior commanders were at their headquarters, rather than in the field with their troops. The command exercised by the politically savvy and technically deficient senior Vietnamese officers was rarely good enough of itself to produce satisfactory results against the VC. The confident Americans were there to do what seemed elementary: help the South Vietnamese army defeat a ragtag guerrilla enemy. About The Battle of Ap Bac. Thereafter, the 7th Division moved from success to success. William Lipscomb, chemist; awarded Nobel Prize in 1976. Joel Chandler Harris, writer, creator of the Uncle Remus tales. In the last months of 1962, the great prize in Vietnam was the Mekong Delta, an incredibly rich area producing most of the rice and a wealth of other crops in South Vietnam. a month. The enemy also had the advantage that their fighting positions were higher than the surrounding rice paddies, with the effect that they could deliver grazing fire across the fields. In fact, more than 300 VC were there, elements of both the 514th Regional Battalion and the 261st Main Force Battalion. The ARVN refused one last counterattack, and the Viet Cong withdrew that same night, taking most of their dead and wounded with them. Vann deliberately left the open rice paddies to the east uncovered. This was where the 7th Division’s ranger platoon had been ambushed, and G-2 evidence was firm that about 100 men of the 514th were resting in the general vicinity of the village of Bac. The cost of his prudence was considerable, for he also gave up control of the countryside to the enemy. The Battle of Ap Bac II. Three H-21s and one of the five escorting UH-1 gun ships were shot down within five minutes, and every single one of the H-21s and all of the UH-1s except one sustained battle damage. In what year did the Battle of Ap Bac take place? For more great articles be sure to subscribe to Vietnam Magazine today! https://historica.fandom.com/wiki/Battle_of_Ap_Bac?oldid=202547. Even muzzle flashes of weapons firing were difficult to see. Dick Van Patten, actor; best known for his role on the TV series Eight is Enough. The VC concentrated their rifle fire against whichever vehicle happened to be in the lead, an easy task since the company was attacking in piecemeal fashion, and tried to kill the drivers and the exposed gunners on the .50-caliber machine guns. The southern part of the delta had been a Viet Cong stronghold for years, as it had been a base area for the Viet Minh during the French Indochinese War. Perhaps the casualties themselves would not have been enough, but Cao had also been so indiscreet as to be unusually successful during his tenure at My Tho. It became something of a cause celebre that changed American views on the war. In Diem’s view, the 7th Division was not important because its tactical zone was crucial to Vietnamese security, but because its location 40 miles from the capital made it his chief guarantee against another military coup. 18 The battle at Bac, however, was more than just another case of official optimism. one day. Sooner or later, Vann knew, the Vietnamese infantry would have to carry the battle to the Viet Cong, and there was absolutely no question that Cao lacked the will to order that kind of fighting. ... Three more North Vietnamese divisions attacked Binh Long Province, captured Loc Ninh, and surrounded An Loc. In May, shortly after Vann arrived as adviser to division commander Colonel Huynh Van Cao, 7th Division patrols surprised a large number of guerrillas who unwisely tried to flee across open terrain. John Malkovich, actor (Places in the Heart), producer (Juno), director, fashion designer. Neil Sheehan, reporting on this phenomenon, noted that the real frustration among the elite airborne officers had been casualties generated by pointless and unproductive fighting. Because of their carefully prepared locations in the tree lines, the VC were very hard to spot. As mentioned, the Viet Cong were particularly anxious for something to kick-start an insurgency that seemed to be losing some steam in light of American involvement. When first confronted with the APC, surprised Viet Cong troops broke and ran, and thus were easily killed. When confronted with the helicopter and the armored personnel carrier, the VC initially ran and were killed in great numbers. Hoping to iron out the inconsistency between what the Military Assistance Command (MACV) commander had told them and what they had seen, Halberstam, Arnett and Neil Sheehan turned to the American adviser to the 7th Division, Lt. Col. John Paul Vann, who told them a different story. It was fought in Định Tường Province (now part of Tiền Giang Province ), South Vietnam. Its light aluminum armor was proof against any weapon the VC had in those days and its .50-caliber Browning heavy machine gun gave it exceptional firepower. Even in the much vaunted 7th Division, the standard of individual training was very low. The invigorated Viet Cong concentrated their fire on the ARVN struggling to get out of the downed helicopters in a "duck shoot", and Vann radioed the ARVN command and urged them to send an APC unit to rescue the men. At that time, North Vietnam was hoping for an election, promised under the Geneva Accords of 1954, that would unite North and South Vietnam. $11.95, unmounted counters; $16.95 with mounted counters. Surprised by helicopters in the past, the Viet Cong had by now learned how to deal with them. Moreover, the Viet Cong commander intended to give his opponents just the sort of battle they had wanted for so long. Evidently using his intelligence sources to send his troops to areas where he was certain they would not find the Viet Cong, Cao diligently obeyed Diem’s orders to be more ‘prudent’ — his regulars suffered only four casualties in the entire period. Battle of Chāldirān, (August 23, 1514), military engagement in which the Ottomans won a decisive victory over the á¹¢afavids of Iran and went on to gain control of eastern Anatolia.Although possession of artillery ensured a decisive victory for the Ottomans, the battle heralded the start of a long war between the rival Muslim powers for control of Anatolia and Iraq. Ap Bac II was a different day for me – I felt my platoon should have been there, but we were on an Tango circling around the Benewah in brigade reserve. They learned that the fighting had ended the day before, and that it had not been a success. Among the 24 prisoners was another battalion commander. Those areas that had been under marginal control began to slip away, and the Viet Cong main forces had the opportunity to recruit and train to make up the losses of the previous four months. Part of Tiá » n Giang Province ), producer ( Juno ), director! ; $ 16.95 with mounted counters cheap, but was unable to get and. 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